This strikes me as at the very least a telling and perhaps even a significant moment in recent television history. Or not. Regardless, the women of The View begin by considering the meaning of Jesse Jackson’s disparaging remarks about Barack Obama. From there, though, Whoopi Goldberg tries to explain the linguistics of power dynamics — Subvert the Dominant Paradigm! — to Elisabeth Hasselbeck. Hasselbeck just doesn’t get it. Because she’s oppressed, too, you see. And there’s just so much hate in the world. So why add more by using coarse language?
Still and all, this is the kind of thing I was talking about at the end of this post. And my point isn’t that I’m vindicated or really smart or anything. Because I don’t think anyone was disagreeing with my rather obvious argument back then. It’s just that although Obama’s candidacy — and, fingers crossed, presidency — isn’t going to wash away centuries of racism, it surely will force many people to confront the cultural dynamics of race in ways that are unsettling, and, again, likely salutary.
Via the often super-cool sociological images.
33 comments
July 20, 2008 at 12:45 pm
John Emerson
Over at Unfogged we’re trying to figure out why Obama refuses to try on the glove that didn’t fit O.J.
Obama says he’s at the country club “looking for the real killer”. Nobody believes that.
[More at my link.]
July 20, 2008 at 12:50 pm
eric
Just quickly, I’d say a couple things. Goldberg is remarkably patient, there.
And what parent has never told a child a) there are things other kids will say that you can’t say; b) there are things I can say that you can’t say? I think inasmuch as Hasselbeck is objecting to those
things, she’s being disingenuous.
July 20, 2008 at 1:00 pm
ari
I totally agree that Hasselbeck is being disingenuous. Moreover, she’s being disingenuous in a particularly passive-aggressive way, it seems, employing a strategy that’s common when discussions turn to race. Or, for that matter, to any number of other thorny subjects.
July 20, 2008 at 1:08 pm
SomeCallMeTim
1. Whoopi Goldberg is the devil, and all she does is in the service of evil, even if it initially seems otherwise. (That is, she is wildly overrated as a comedienne. She isn’t funny at all.)
2. I don’t understand why you think being forced to confront race because of Obama would be salutary. I could see it being pretty ugly. If Obama wins and we do have to talk about race, it’s mostly going to need to be beating back people who call him a race pimp or the like. And our side hasn’t shown much ability to do that aggressively or even all that convincingly.
July 20, 2008 at 1:11 pm
Zach
Wow, crazy white people, huh? I like when Hasselbeck starts to tear up….she clearly carries the weight of centuries of black oppression on her shoulders.
July 20, 2008 at 1:12 pm
Neddy Merrill
Not that it matters much, but do you think EH is being disingenuous or just really simple-minded?
If I were black– I know, it’s shocking that a philosopher isn’t–I imagine I would think that one reason to stop using the damn word is that it lets us avoid more of these really tiresome conversations about why it’s different when white people say it.
July 20, 2008 at 1:13 pm
ari
The problems are there and painful already, Tim. Talking about them, if the talk leads to productive change — or even an acknowledgment of the problems — might be salutary. But again, note in the original post and here and that I’ve said “likely salutary.” I’m not making any promises.
Regardless, in this case at least, having Goldberg calmly explain to Hasselbeck — and the viewers of the show — that there are linguistic power dynamics that affect who should and shouldn’t say certain things is likely salutary. Or at least I hope so.
July 20, 2008 at 1:14 pm
Sociological Images » BLOGS THAT LINK TO US AND SAY NICE STUFF :)
[…] links More on satire. Sort of. And also other stuff.wow, a frank conversation about race on the viewSunday linksMen Beware: Fear of spiders will make […]
July 20, 2008 at 1:15 pm
Cala
You are not tricking me into watching The View.
July 20, 2008 at 1:15 pm
SomeCallMeTim
Regardless, in this case at least, having Goldberg calmly explain to Hasselbeck — and the viewers of the show — that there are linguistic power dynamics that affect who should and shouldn’t say certain things is likely salutary. Or at least I hope so.
It just means that Goldberg will added to the list of race pimps.
July 20, 2008 at 1:17 pm
Neddy Merrill
SCMTim, the world’s first race meta-pimp.
July 20, 2008 at 1:18 pm
SomeCallMeTim
Or, put another way, I cringe every time race comes up this election season because I figure it represents a half point loss somewhere in a swing state.
July 20, 2008 at 1:20 pm
ari
Nice try, Cala, everyone knows about your daytime t.v. addiction.
July 20, 2008 at 1:21 pm
ari
Or, put another way, I cringe every time race comes up this election season because I figure it represents a half point loss somewhere in a swing state.
Not when the conversation happens on The View, I don’t think. Especially not when the conversation is prompted by Jesse Jackson having said mean things about Obama being too hard on black men.
July 20, 2008 at 1:38 pm
New Kid on the Hallway
I think Elizabeth Hasselbeck is just really simple-minded. This is the same woman who declared on national TV (okay, I guess that’s obvious) that she didn’t believe in evolution and thought ID should be taught in schools. Dim, dim, dim!
July 20, 2008 at 1:47 pm
Jason B
This is the same woman who declared on national TV (okay, I guess that’s obvious) that she didn’t believe in evolution and thought ID should be taught in schools.
The problem with people who deny evolution is that they have a good reason to: they clearly haven’t evolved enough to handle that tricky “critical thinking” stuff, so evolution can’t be real.
July 20, 2008 at 2:02 pm
SomeCallMeTim
SCMTim, the world’s first race meta-pimp.
Yeah, “race pimp” is a phrase that has really been bothering me for the last three or four weeks. For some reason, it took me until then to realize that the use of the word “pimp” was probably connected to the race of the person (usually J. Jackson or Sharpton, in my exprience) being described. So now I’m suddenly outraged, and still further angered by all the outrage opportunities I previously missed.
July 20, 2008 at 2:19 pm
bitchphd
I also think she’s just really simple-minded.
I imagine I would think that one reason to stop using the damn word is that it lets us avoid more of these really tiresome conversations about why it’s different when white people say it.
Look at you, whitey, telling black people what they should do.dddddddddd
July 20, 2008 at 2:20 pm
bitchphd
Um, not sure why I was resting my finger on the “d” key when I hit “submit” there….
July 20, 2008 at 3:05 pm
Neddy Merrill
You’re obsessed with Dave Noon’s penis?
July 20, 2008 at 3:09 pm
ari
Who isn’t?
July 20, 2008 at 4:24 pm
Neddy Merrill
Thanks, Standpipe.
July 20, 2008 at 4:31 pm
ari
My pleasure.
July 20, 2008 at 5:37 pm
Brad
Can I just boggle at the idea of any discussion of race on mainstream TV? (Thanks)
I could care less if Hasselbeck is a bit dense, her view is a very common one.
(I am amused that, when discussing her heritage, she brought up an insult for the Polish side, and not one that for her Italian side which would still have some currency. Of course, that is mostly an north east thing and outside of the scope of this blog….)
July 20, 2008 at 8:06 pm
bitchphd
Neddy, that’s none of your business.
July 21, 2008 at 5:01 am
The Great Whatsit » The View on the n-word
[…] The Edge of the American West, here’s a fairly remarkable clip from everyone’s favorite daytime talk show, The […]
July 21, 2008 at 9:44 am
Walt
I finally watched this video, and EH’s comments aren’t nearly as stupid as they’ve been made out to be. (There’s a small liberal vice of thinking that the truth is always so obvious that it never needs to be explained to someone for the first time.)
Whoopi Goldberg was awesome, though.
July 21, 2008 at 10:41 am
neocynic
I broke down and, against my better judgement, I finally watched the video. I couldn’t sit through the whole thing, mostly because that kind of show–with a pack of knuckleheads all talking over the top of each other like a bucket of crabs trying to escape–makes me nuts.
Whoopi made her case much better than Hasselbeck expressed her nonsense, but it was still all crap.
The notion of ownership of words, ideas, or meaning is nonsense.
Of course, I’m no proponent of property rights in general, so maybe I’m not the one to pipe up just now.
Reminder #592 why the media sucks. They put public discourse of Serious Issues in the hands of halfwits.
July 21, 2008 at 1:05 pm
Alexandra
Suggesting that one race may use a word, and that another may not, is racist. (of course I am not condoning racial slurs though) Read you Voltaire. Arguing over one race’s entitlement(!) to use a word, while suggesting another race must not, is media farce at its best. Much as I dislike EH’s views in general, she presented more substance in her position than WG, who affects a superior PC personna, but got caught in the bright lights on this one. A Racist View.
July 21, 2008 at 3:36 pm
Walt
You have got to be kidding me.
July 23, 2008 at 9:33 am
Spontaneous Social Symmetry Breaking | Cosmic Variance
[…] For reasons which escape me, this concept has not been borrowed (as far as I can tell) by social scientists and pundits more generally.* Which is too bad, as it explains a great deal. For example, appealing to the concept of spontaneous symmetry breaking would have been really helpful to Whoopi Goldberg on The View recently, as she patiently tried to explain to a distraught Elisabeth Hasselbeck why it’s just not the same when black people use the word “nigger” as when white people do. (From Sociological Images, via The Edge of the American West.) […]
July 23, 2008 at 11:14 am
Spontaneous Social Symmetry Breaking | Marriage Blog
[…] For reasons which escape me, this concept has not been borrowed (as far as I can tell) by social scientists and pundits more generally.* Which is too bad, as it explains a great deal. For example, appealing to the concept of spontaneous symmetry breaking would have been really helpful to Whoopi Goldberg on The View recently, as she patiently tried to explain to a distraught Elisabeth Hasselbeck why it’s just not the same when black people use the word “nigger” as when white people do. (From Sociological Images, via The Edge of the American West.) […]
July 25, 2008 at 5:10 pm
Spontaneous Social Symmetry Breaking | test
[…] For reasons which escape me, this concept has not been borrowed (as far as I can tell) by social scientists and pundits more generally.* Which is too bad, as it explains a great deal. For example, appealing to the concept of spontaneous symmetry breaking would have been really helpful to Whoopi Goldberg on The View recently, as she patiently tried to explain to a distraught Elisabeth Hasselbeck why it’s just not the same when black people use the word “nigger” as when white people do. (From Sociological Images, via The Edge of the American West.) […]